Men … what would you say to a single woman who is reaching 40, has followed all the ‘rules,’ has saved herself for that one man … who has tried to live a life honoring God and preparing for marriage and family … who has been faithful in church, stayed healthy and in shape … and who wrote this:
Where is the man:
who knows what he wants,
who isn’t afraid of commitment,
who keeps his word,
and who is confident enough to go after what he wants?
I want to be pursued.
I want to know he wants me because he wants me.
Are my expectations are too high?
Am I asking for too much?
Do men like this exist?
i’d say i understand why she’s 40 and single
in her effort to attract men, she begins by listing 4 qualifications that must be met by her Mystery Man
listing requisite qualifications is certainly the approach of the modern female, but i dont recommend it
“isnt afraid of commitment” is one of the oldest female set-ups in the book (you can only be “unafraid” if youre good enough to commit to HER)
LOL!
mebbe teenage boys would fall for that…
she then polishes off her, uh, List of Demands by sharing two Additional Wants
i have yet to read ANYTHING about what I’M getting (other, you know, than the delight of her middle-aged company and cognitive brilliance)
even tho she’s forty, the body isnt the primary problem — it’s the attitude
instead of trying to manouever guys into relationship/marriage position, she should humble herself before God, then humble herself before the men in her life, and likewise to any man she meets when hoping for interaction
she’s already at the edge of fertility shutdown, so she must make herself super-attractive (to MEN) by displaying qualites that few, or none, of the other women are displaying . . . and TRUE humility and appreciation of masculinity would be right at the top of that no-fly list in our feminist times and nations
i’ll give an example: theres a local woman working at the large grocery store checkouts, and each time i go thru her line, she has a big, warm smile on her face, like me walking up just made her day
she’s probably around fifty, and looks it, but is well groomed and presentable, and tho the job isnt exciting obviously, she makes the best of the small task she’s given, the smile is never faked, and she makes it clear to me that she would obey me in an instant (tho i’m essentially a semi-stranger to her)
now if i were available and wife-hunting (i’m not, and not) she’s one of the first i’d explore further, b/c she’s already shown me superior qualities, on various levels, while demanding NO “qualifications” from me
now if i were available and wife-hunting (i’m not, and not) she’s one of the first i’d explore further, b/c she’s already shown me superior qualities, on various levels, while demanding NO “qualifications” from me
How do you know she’s not online writing little venting rants like the above?
Angry and frustrated? I thought all that at one point.
I mean, at 40, sure chances are SOMEONE SOMEWHERE has made an advance, but is that completely true?
I mean, 25, someone somewhere has made an advance, right?
Well yeah – non-christians who have emotional boundary issues and little self-respect. Picky? Or Discerning?
Well yeah – a Christian in love with his best friend while taking me on dates. Commitment Issues. True or False? (I did dump him when I figured this out, fyi)
I mean, I didn’t compromise on my VALUES. I just compromised on how I found the guy with those values. I didn’t trust on a friend hook-up, I didn’t go to church to find him, and I took a shot in the dark on a guy who very easily could have gone the opposite direction.
By the age of 40, this woman has seen her peers get married – has seen men “pursue” her friends. Ask them on dates. Asked them to marry them. She has an idea that that is how its supposed to happen. Is she really wrong? What’s she doing? Mis-reading signs?
Hell, 18 months of random conversations in the halls of work while I’m chatting with guys online seeing if there’s someone out there for me. Is that what’s been going on with her? Maybe she got some totally random invite when she said she was interested in something that wasn’t tied to anything serious and she never took them up on it…like a motorcycle ride. “Oh, you never rode a motorcycle? Give me a call sometime. I’ll take you.” Friends? More? Shot in the dark, frustrated, angry – I made that call … I’ll take a bike ride.
Reality – our interactions with the other sex were much simpler when they were limited. If a man was talking to you, he WAS interested – because he had to ask Dad for permission to even get THAT far.
Mixxed signals aren’t just a thing of girl-dom. So lets not throw everything on the sad, frustrated, angry, depressed girl who saved herself for FORTY years for seemingly diddly-squat.
Obviously all the confident men knew exactly what they wanted and all went for it… it wasn’t her though.
Yep.
Based on the information in the post and her words, I’m not exactly sure what to say, other than unfortunately, there are plenty of deserving folks – male and female alike – who are still waiting for a godly spouse. That, and there are some who broke all the ‘rules,’ along with more than a few of the Commandments, and still got married.
I came across this somewhat related post over at the Stand Firm blog. I don’t know if it will help, but I’ll post it anyway.
http://www.standfirminfaith.com/?/sf/page/29964
Wow.
I loved that. Its much more honest, affirming, and grace-filled than anything else I’ve seen on the subject.
Loved this part especially:
“For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by men, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Let the one who is able to receive this receive it.” (Matthew 19:12 ESV)
I would say to her thusly, when you were in your 20’s men like me were around, but you rebuffed us. Not a problem, we guys ended up with termagents of our own doing, got divorced, some got away, some lost everything. Now in our 40’s and low 50’s, there is no shortage of 30 something women who just want to have fun, dont want kids, and seem so accepting of the men we are, and always were. The man you are looking for already had his core shredded by the ex, the courts, the church, and now government. It is no surprise that you may seem to him, a less interesting manifestation of the disaster he already went through. I would suggest buying a motorcycle, as many of the men you think you would like to meet, already have, and do what you have to do, or go and get a few cats.
Can’t answer her case in particular. Good people can and do fall through the cracks.
OTOH, a lot of guys here will read what she has written, and come to different conclusions based on what they’ve observed.
The more relevant issue is whether she–or her potential suitors–would be willing to drop the cynicism and cut the other some slack?
I’ll ne frank here: everyone f***s up. I’m not talking about purity here; I’m saying that no one says all the right things or makes all the right moves in a relationship.
But the question is whether one side is expecting perfection in this area.
At her age, she’s going to have lots of baggage, even if she’s a virgin. Same is true for guys in her bracket. Will each accept the other?
i find all of this interesting … and continue to welcome your thoughts and comments.
women have these certain perceptions of what they think men are and are not. that is not necessarily right or wrong in and of itself … we all have perceptions … when it goes very awry is when other women chime in and encourage unrealistic, or even borderline-unrealistic, expectations of men.
one example – a pic with these words that i saw on fb:
“Every girl wants a guy who she can run up to with her hair a mess, no makeup, and the first thing he says is, ‘You’re beautiful.'”
oh.my.gawash! you cannot imagine how quickly women jumped all over this … screaming YES!
one man had the guts to write, “fairy tale.”
sure, there are men out there who love that look, but not all men do … and that doesn’t make them right or wrong or good or bad. my husband loves my hair long and loves it when i’m all ‘dolled up.’ absolutely nothin wrong with that. does he still think i’m beautiful in the raw? absolutely. but he LOVES it when i’m all dolled up. so i get all dolled up for him and keep my hair long.
some women would say i’m being controlled by my husband. but i say … there are things i like about him that he does for me, and that i want him to do for me, because they make me feel valued and appreciated and special … that’s true for ALL women. why, then, can it not be true for men? it can. and it should. it makes him feel respected and valued and special when i do things just for him that he, personally, likes.
anyway … back to my point … what women encourage other women to think and believe is powerful (hence, encourage women to choose wise, female friends) … and it’s rampant.
other women will jump all over what this reachin-40-year-old woman has said and tell her, “Keep On, Girl!” “You’re Worth It!” “Don’t Settle!” “He’s Out There!”
i think it’s important to hear what you men have to say. i think women need to hear what men have to say … and they need to really listen to ya’ll.
not only the women need to hear this, but the church needs to hear this and stop encouraging women to not settle for anything less than ‘godly perfection.’ i’ve been in a women’s bible study where the mature (and very beautiful) widow leading the bible study talked about how she swoons over ‘godly men’ … and all the ladies went googly-eyed. oh.my.gawash. ya’ll can dissect how terrible that is. (one of the first questions other church women asked me that i hated hearing when i was engaged to my husband: “Is he a godly man?”) ‘godly’ is relative.
That’s the thing: with all that “don’t settle!” talk, one runs the risk of making the perfect the enemy of the good.
There’s a fine line between prudence and perfectionism. Where does one end and the other begin? I’m not sure there’s a hard answer. At the same time, if she’s been dismissive of decent men in her circles–even if they don’t have every “i” dotted and “t” crossed–she may have some of her own junk to own there.
When I read what she posted, I’ll have to admit: I tended to empathize with what Ray had to say. While I cannot judge her personally–I don’t know her–what she said came off as perfectionism cloaked in “woe is me.”
OTOH, it is possible that she has fallen through the cracks. It is also possible that she made one or two mistakes early on, and–due to the current dating landscape–the price for those mistakes has, fairly or unfairly, gone up significantly.
I’d also include “marriage and family law” as things other than just “the dating landscape” that create strong incentives for men to impose an extremely high price on a lot of different mistakes.
My big question is whether the above is how this woman consistently comes off thing. Everyone seems to have their grouchy / woe-is-me days every now and then.
Dave – i don’t know her really well; i know her sister much better. i think she’s one of those ‘good girls’ who has done all the right things for the seemingly right reasons b/c that’s what the church taught her to do, and now she’s very frustrated b/c she’s seen all these who haven’t followed hardly any rules seemingly happily married with kids.
Amir touched on something that i think is at play here: “The more relevant issue is whether she–or her potential suitors–would be willing to drop the cynicism and cut the other some slack?”
“That’s the thing: with all that “don’t settle!” talk, one runs the risk of making the perfect the enemy of the good.”
i think it’s more … would the CHURCH be willing to drop the critical judgement of men and cut them some slack, stop making perfect the enemy of the good, so that good women who want to honor God within the church don’t feel guilty for dating good men who don’t fit some ol’ bitty’s idea of a “godly man.”
i honestly struggled with this while dating my now-husband. my first husband fits the church’s idea of a godly man perfectly, but he is anything but. my new husband would probably cause quite a few bitty ol ladies noses to snuff at him, but he’s more “godly” than most men i know and loves my girls and myself as unconditionally as any i’ve heard or seen, ever. i had some people praying for me when dating him. and i sought God all the time. i kept trying to find ways out, but God kept telling me to stay in. there were enough ‘church ways’ i could find to give me an ‘out’ in this relationship, but God was firm. i had one very close friend who finally told me to stop looking for ways out and start discovering ways to stay and make it work. my whole world changed at that moment … continually for the best. 3.5 years into this marriage, and i am continually in awe of his love for me and his willingness to be a man and stand his ground. he puts me in my place, but he does it with so much love that i can’t help but want to submit and honor him.
but i’ll tell you this … even now … so many bitty’s in the church would say he doesn’t follow the rules, so he’s not a ‘godly man.’ they’re wrong … but if i were listening to them, i’d be alone and lonely and would have missed the very best thing that ever happened to me. is my husband perfect? not by a long shot. but he’s my imperfect.
This is me with my husband. He was not a church goer- and still drags his feet to the door. Anyone in church would say get away from him if I was actually honest about it. I’m not. I like him and I’d like to keep the judgement out.
There are so many things the church would just scorn at if they knew. But this guy is so more right for me than anyone I could’ve asked for. I mean, I was snappy at him last night for asking me to do something 4 times in one breath and he starts going off about how I shouldn’t snap at him…and repeated it over and over again the same way he was asking me to do that thing for him. I ended up laughing instead of stomping my feet in a hissy fit.
Seriously, my “ideal” guy woulda just shut up and I woulda kept being pissed off.
It seems that our “ideals” are tied up in who we think we are or who we want to be. I’m not a graceful, demure girl. I’m up-tight, anxious and easily frustrated – traits that just keep boiling up when I’m around people all day because I’m also an intravert. I have a sense of humor, but one that recognizes humor in others and can be made to laugh at myself, but not one that creates humor.
My husband is my opposite and moderates me. So when I spend time thinking about whether my husband is “Godly”, I end up being dissatisfied with him because of this stupid ideal put in me by who knows where. But when I step back and look at us (like last night), I realize God made him for me.
Good for you! God made him FOR YOU!
Are you ugly?
Me? You bet! LOL
John … he’s being goofy … he’s a very handsome man! (obviously Mrs. L hasn’t read this yet!)
but … is the woman ugly? no. she’s more on the plain and simple side, but she’s not ugly.
uhhh … me? 🙂
nope.
my husband is an east texas country man, and he likes women all dolled up. but, no, i’m not ugly, and i don’t need makeup – though i love it and will rarely leave home without it … mostly b/c i have very fair skin and look very washed out without makeup, or so i think.
Sometimes the signs that someone likes you are too subtle to see. There may have been some men who liked her but did not pursue her in a way that she found meaningful. That happens. I’ve also had some of the guys say they don’t see anything they like among the girls they see at church. Lots of the singles I know are all online trying to find someone else. However, four of my friends began to see each other a little differently and for some reason the sparks flew and they gave it a shot. Two are still dating.
There was a Christian guy at my church who I wanted to date and we seemed to like each other, but he never was able to do anything that I understood to be interest – even when we went to a concert together. I was nervous. He was very late. Instead of having a bite with me, he went home to eat before the concert. After this “date” he stopped talking to me. I had to move on. Another guy I went out with once and had a pretty good date said he would call me later in the week but didn’t. I moved on. A few months later he contacted me telling me how sorry he was. I was already seeing someone else.
I’m sure this girl is like so many of my friends – a nice girl who really wants a quality relationship with a quality man.
The church/Christianity has made a few mistakes. Rock music was once considered evil and they spoke out against it. Now most churches have a praise band which plays so-so rock every Sunday. Rock went from public outcry to acceptance. I have to say I really miss some of that Christian alternative rock stuff, but oh well.
Dating seems to have gone through a similar public outcry that there was something very bad about dating and that Christians should not partake in it whatsoever. In the end, dating will come to be accepted again.
People have made the ridiculous mistake of thinking that “settling down” is “settling for second best.” Now that I am about to be married I see that settling down means that your spirit is quiet and you don’t need to run around to every social event. I am content. I actually am going to miss a few things about being single. But I can tell you this much, most of my friends that went to really fun parties on New Years Day would love to trade places with me and a quiet evening in with their significant other.
Savvy – welcome back … and Congratulations! marriage is awesome 🙂
SAVVY!!! So excited for you!!! Congratulations!